What do you guys think of this?

[Sal Collaziano]

I hear lots of old songs making comebacks with new tracks and vocals (by new artists). Personally, I don't think there could be any improvement to the vocals in classic Freestyle songs.. The only thing that's keeping some of these songs from being played (again) is the old style sound.

How many of you can EASILY tell that a song is old and "classic" by the sound of the music? Why not bring back some of the classics with a new "sound" behind the original vocals?

I don't mean drastically changing the "way" the song sounds - just the "instruments" used to play them. In other words, everything sounds the same other than the fact that the new version sounds like it was made yesterday...

Is this possible? If so, can't we try it with a few songs just to see what happens? Don't be offended but I feel many people are embarrassed to play Freestyle songs from the 80s because the sound is "cheesy" compared to what technology has allowed today...

 

[Kenny Guido]

many artists try to do this but only a few have succeeded. many fans dont like it when a classic is reused to satisfy a newer generation of kids that may not appreciate where the sound originated from.

 

[Sal Collaziano]

Who's done it? Let's see a list. I think Judy Torres recently. Right?

I may not be explaining myself as well as I should. I want the sound to be very, very similar. No change AT ALL in speed or tempo. Just the use of today's technology to make the old sounds a bit fresher. SOME of the "old" style digital sounds can be replaced with new ones that have the same basic structure - just not as flat..

It's not easy for me to explain what I want here - but I think a lot of music could benefit from something like this..

 

[MIX1027FMDJ]

Who's done it? Let's see a list. I think Judy Torres recently. Right?

Well to start off Shannon did a remake of Let the Music Play in 2004...

However my personal opinion is that the classic freestyle tracks should be left alone with because "remakes" sound like shit IMO.

 

[PartyUpGirlz]

Well to start off Shannon did a remake of Let the Music Play in 2004...
However my personal opinion is that the classic freestyle tracks should be left alone with because "remakes" sound like shit IMO.

Yes, but remixes could work. No?

 

[MIX1027FMDJ]

Yes, but remixes could work. No?

Sure remixes would work so long as the remixer was one who could handle it properly, not one of the bedroom remixer guys..

I would remix some...and in fact going to later this year and in 09'.

 

[NY Dance Music Coal]

Funny you mention this Sal.

There have been a couple of current and new artists that have been seeking out the coalition to find vocalists for them. In turn, I am reaching out to the legends to help make that happen!

I figure this, if there's any way current dance is going to forge forward (not just freestyle but dance music as a whole), it may have to be going "back" and getting what is familiar, beloved and known and move that into the current and future sounds of dance.

It's a project that is a work in progress with our coalition and I invite and will reach out to ANY artist in here if they want to get involved with such a collaboration. All I would be is the "middleman" and I don't want a cent out of it.

 

[Sal Collaziano]

Yes, but remixes could work. No?

This is probably closer to what I'm trying to say. The songs would technically sound the same - but they would NOT sound "old" or "classic". Kids today don't want to hear old music. Old music sounds old. Old vocals? Vocals haven't changed. We don't have a "new" way of singing. So the vocals should remain the same - they were perfect years ago. There is no way to improve them.

On the other hand, technology has advanced in such a way that the sound of music is much different in today's music. If TKA's "One Way Love" was made today with the same vocals and the same type of sounds, it would sound much different.

The meaning of the spoken words in Freestyle songs from 20 years ago are still valid today - and probably always will be. The sound of the music is old and substandard. Fix this, play the songs on the radio, and they'll get requested by young people. That's all we need...

Can we make this happen?

Please! No changing the vocals! Why fix what's not broken?

 

[Janko]

@Sal, this can be interesting!

 

[MIX1027FMDJ]

This is probably closer to what I'm trying to say. The songs would technically sound the same - but they would NOT sound "old" or "classic". Kids today don't want to hear old music. Old music sounds old. Old vocals? Vocals haven't changed. We don't have a "new" way of singing. So the vocals should remain the same - they were perfect years ago. There is no way to improve them.

On the other hand, technology has advanced in such a way that the sound of music is much different in today's music. If TKA's "One Way Love" was made today with the same vocals and the same type of sounds, it would sound much different.

The meaning of the spoken words in Freestyle songs from 20 years ago are still valid today - and probably always will be. The sound of the music is old and substandard. Fix this, play the songs on the radio, and they'll get requested by young people. That's all we need...

Can we make this happen?

Please! No changing the vocals! Why fix what's not broken?

Sal good idea except for one thing....most groups. take TKA for example, would not get back together to re-do vocals...and for the most part most of the master 1/4", 1/2" and even 2" tape is gone. And what is surprising to me is that EVERY artist that I have ever asked if they had any tape or even copy of their tracks their universal answer was "NO" ! That really suprised me to no end.

Let's assume you got the vocals, ok now we are talking production, who is going to be on top of their game to produce this properly?????

Off the top of my head maybe Carlos Barrios, Rick Savage, myself, Micky Garcia and a few others...then the final question is the one about the dollars. People WILL NOT invest in these projects unless a return greater than investment is almost guaranteed. That is why you get bedroom production today because most so-called producers have a PC or Mac and run somekind of studio software they have an illegal copy of anyway because most do not have the money to pay for a legal copy of it. I paid over 2 grad to buy Sony's suite of audio and video professional studio software because it is what most professional studios use. But 2 grans is just the starting point when you add the cost of additional kit software that you may or will need.

I personally don't see that happening in the near future because everybody today expects their new music to come off of livewire for free...today's music people expect their tunes for free and that is not a profitable business model. But I am not saying that it can't be done.

Let's be happy for the original tracks that we have...they are still very valid on todays dance floors and radio

 

[damultieditjunke]

Sal good idea except for one thing....most groups. take TKA for example, would not get back together to re-do vocals...and for the most part most of the master 1/4", 1/2" and even 2" tape is gone. And what is surprising to me is that EVERY artist that I have ever asked if they had any tape or even copy of their tracks their universal answer was "NO" ! That really suprised me to no end.

Let's assume you got the vocals, ok now we are talking production, who is going to be on top of their game to produce this properly?????

Off the top of my head maybe Carlos Barrios, Rick Savage, myself, Micky Garcia and a few others...then the final question is the one about the dollars. People WILL NOT invest in these projects unless a return greater than investment is almost guaranteed. That is why you get bedroom production today because most so-called producers have a PC or Mac and run somekind of studio software they have an illegal copy of anyway because most do not have the money to pay for a legal copy of it. I paid over 2 grad to buy Sony's suite of audio and video professional studio software because it is what most professional studios use. But 2 grans is just the starting point when you add the cost of additional kit software that you may or will need.

I personally don't see that happening in the near future because everybody today expects their new music to come off of livewire for free...today's music people expect their tunes for free and that is not a profitable business model. But I am not saying that it can't be done.

Let's be happy for the original tracks that we have...they are still very valid on todays dance floors and radio

Tony this is a excelent point you bring up....

You can just hear the difference of the stuff that was mixed on a 100 000 dollarss SSL Console back in days as compared to the bedroom pc/mac stuff were hearing today ...

and how are people making $$ in the music industry in todays time?
with almost everyone getting the music for free via file shareing.....

 

[Sal Collaziano]

Sal good idea except for one thing....most groups. take TKA for example, would not get back together to re-do vocals...

I think this is exactly why it WOULD work. Because what I'm asking for here is that everything be redone WITH EXCEPTION to the vocals. I want the vocals to be exactly what they are. There's no way to improve them. In fact, I don't believe ANYONE (even the original artists) could improve on them in ANY way or form. They should remain IDENTICAL to what they are now...

How much would it cost to produce ONE song? Hell, I'll pay for it.

 

[RickSavage]

Tony this is a excelent point you bring up....
You can just hear the difference of the stuff that was mixed on a 100 000 dollarss SSL Console back in days as compared to the bedroom pc/mac stuff were hearing today ...
and how are people making $$ in the music industry in todays time?
with almost everyone getting the music for free via file shareing.....

I can Mix your (Electronic Dance Track) on the 80 channel SSL 9000J series for $1800, Or an internal Digital Mix on Cubase 4 for $500. The reason most of the stuff today sounds like crap is because most unreleased tracks never reach the Master House... This is where the final touches of quality are applied.

I make my money today from project to project, & almost all is for work for hire.. I do not get involved with points unless I feel it worth it... 90% of my work today is mix projects.. To make money today, you have to put work out like a well oiled machine maintaining quality... Most vocal artists with a hit make jack shit on record sales, but make very good money doing gigs. Some of the fairly new dance artists with hits I know (Last five years or so) (not freestyle) can make six figures easy in a years time just doing gigs.

 

[Sal Collaziano]

Interesting, Savage... So it appears as if you may have the ability to do just what we need here. Like you said, "ost vocal artists with a hit make jack shit on record sales" (of course, with the internet - everything has changed) - but you also said, "but make very good money doing gigs. Some of the fairly new dance artists with hits I know (Last five years or so) (not freestyle) can make six figures easy in a years time just doing gigs.".

That all sounds very good to me.. Unfortunately, I expected more input on this... It appears as if the mainstay of our group is not interested in my proposition...

 

[MIX1027FMDJ]

Interesting, Savage... So it appears as if you may have the ability to do just what we need here. Like you said, "ost vocal artists with a hit make jack shit on record sales" (of course, with the internet - everything has changed) - but you also said, "but make very good money doing gigs. Some of the fairly new dance artists with hits I know (Last five years or so) (not freestyle) can make six figures easy in a years time just doing gigs.".

That all sounds very good to me.. Unfortunately, I expected more input on this... It appears as if the mainstay of our group is not interested in my proposition...

I was going to do a project like this early last year with a major "freestyle" record label, however it never happened because the master tapes were not available.

 

[Sal Collaziano]

I was going to do a project like this early last year with a major "freestyle" record label, however it never happened because the master tapes were not available.

Tell me more about these Master Tapes. I'm not in the business so I'm not familiar with the term. I'm assuming it's the individual tracks of each song. If this is the case, is there no way to abstract the vocal tracks from music?

I also find it very difficult to believe that an artist would trash his work. It just doesn't make sense. There's got to be some reason they don't want their work tampered with.

 

[MIX1027FMDJ]

Tell me more about these Master Tapes. I'm not in the business so I'm not familiar with the term. I'm assuming it's the individual tracks of each song. If this is the case, is there no way to abstract the vocal tracks from music?

I also find it very difficult to believe that an artist would trash his work. It just doesn't make sense. There's got to be some reason they don't want their work tampered with.

Sal, the master tapes are usually 2" tape that the vocals and music is recorded to from doing the mixdowns directly from the mixing board. I did not say that the artists trashed their work, I said that the artists usually never got their own copy of their work for them to keep, the producer usually just kept it and most of the time these master tapes I am referring to are lost or damaged from not being stored correctly.

Also keep in mind that we are dealing with magnetic tape and it does degrade over time naturally, like watching a VCR tape that is 25 years old, it is never crisp and sharp as the day you bought it and played it for the first time.

 

[Sal Collaziano]

I see. Thank you for the explanation. So how about the ability to abstract vocal tracks from within songs? Possible?

 

[Kid Heartbreak]

and how are people making $$ in the music industry in todays time?
with almost everyone getting the music for free via file shareing.....

I've been wondering how long it would take for someone to notice this on these boards. Everyone talks as if the music industry is even anything close to what it was back in the 90s. It's not even what it was up until 5 years ago. The whole thing is over. I went from selling 4 or 5 thousand units everytime I would drop a mix (every few months) to barely being able to sell a thousand copies in over a year's time of dropping a mix. There's not even that many djs left coming out with mix CDs here in Chicago. Just the new comers cuz they're the only one's who would find it worth it to put all that work in without any potential for profit. Most of the legendary djs (at least here in Chicago) have left the industry altogether, resulting in a decline of musical quality. It's not just a "mixtape" industry problem, it's something that's destroyed the entire music industry altogether. This can't go on. There were a lot of people eating off of the dollars that the music retail industry would bring in (producers, manufacturers, record labels, distributors, retailers, artists, djs, and many more). All these people are basically out of a job. Without the revenue, eventually whatever is left of the music industry will cave in also. Looking at some of the prices y'all were throwing out there for production work, who would be able to afford to pay that without any chance at any making money off their work. It doesn't even make any sense. There aren't even that many music retailers still in business. WTF? The internet has been around for a long time now. It didn't have to destroy the music industry (at least not like this) up until 3 or 4 years ago. It's all the fault of these technology peepz who think that changing shit to be more "advanced" is the way to go. Sometimes things are just fine the way they are and this is a testament to that. The problem is that people have too much stored up energy inside them without any brains. That's why you have all these babies being born to people who can't even get along. I think people need to smoke some weed, chill out, and think about what they do beforehand. The death of the music industry is so symbolic of the deterioration of society in general.

 

[Kid Heartbreak]

And another thing, wouldn't all you need to reproduce the old school tracks be the accapella? If you're going to be re-doing the beats, then why would you need anything more than the accapella. There's plenty of classic freestyle with accapellas out there. Why does everyone keep missing the obvious?